The Ghost of Sahar and vs 3rd Tier Branding

Morning Folks!!

Sahar sent me the link below the other day and knew I would not be able to resist blogging about it. Prick! ;-)

Let me pull out the single most idiotic statement in their 'Expert' opinions. This is the reason why there is still so much upside in domaining.

'In our client's goal is to build a strong brand, we advise against the adoption of generics or near-generics as their company or domain name. We far prefer the ownable, brandable to, for example.'

Wonder what other wrong moves they would 'Prefer'. And this is just one of the reasons I always say your journey to success usually fails on the very first few steps. Welcome to designed failure.

Have a GREAT Day!

Rick Schwartz

24 thoughts on “The Ghost of Sahar and vs 3rd Tier Branding

  1. Michael

    Haha, so if you can afford they would totally you rather buy because it’s cheaper and you will get just as much traffic! LOL :p
    Have you guys tried the Google app on the iPhone? It’s awesome with voice command! I told it to search for virtual vineyard and came up haha

  2. KJG

    Well, they’re obviously not rocket scientists, using language like this:
    • Is the name be available as a URL?

  3. UFO

    You’re not right Rick, you are partial right in some circumstances.
    It depends on the lifecycle of the brand being developed and the type of good service being promoted and the level of financial backing.
    However the writer of the piece that you have shown is also clearly wrong, generics in certain circumstances etc etc can be very beneficial for the development of a business.
    So, rather than black and white, yes and no to generics I think people should be saying ‘depends’.
    As examples compare v, v

  4. Gary

    they forward their brandable to the generic and brand on that.
    pot – kettle – black?

  5. Joao

    I thought this was a joke, but they actually mean it! So funny…
    Gary, i think it’s more about the white line…

  6. Know-it-all Developer

    “In our client’s goal is to build a strong brand,….”
    Say what? Who taught these folks how to write?
    It looks like someone trying to break into the market when they have no experience.

  7. Russ

    It gets better, Gary. Their name includes the hyphen, so not only do they not practice what they preach wrt forwarding to, but they don’t own their proper name,
    Instead someone has it framing with the title”Master McNeil makes Swirl Pie Dung”

  8. Kobe Green

    Actually, VIRTUALVINEYARD.COM is a desirable domain name. Catchy. Easily remembered. Passes the”radio” test. Sticky.
    Of course the wisdom of picking it over WINE.COM is foolhardy, but if you are the buyer and is priced out of your comfort zone (and it most certainly is for most people) then is an excellent alternative.
    I really should go into the domain name consulting business but I’m too busy snatching up dotcoms. One day if I were to slow down, I may do just that. Or perhaps go into SEO consulting. Hmmn. I wonder if SEOCONSULTANT.COM is available…

  9. Cara Mia

    I agree is catchy however…
    “virtual vineyard” global monthly searches = 140
    “wine” global monthly searches = 24,900,000
    they would end up spending a fortune in advertising anyway since is is a highly competitive market.

  10. Kobe Green

    There we go again with”numbers” and search results.
    If we judge the names based on their merits alone without bringing in externalities like search results and how many pies Grandma Rosa(tm) baked last Christmas, you’d have to agree that”virtual vineyard” has a certain ring to it. It”hits the juggular” as I like to put it when I am advising clients on domain choices.
    No one is denying that WINE.COM is preferable. But like or or, those are top tier domains that you’d have to give an arm, two legs and your first born to acquire.
    Are you prepared and willing to be a one armed, wheelchair bound parent of a missing kid?
    No one’s asking if I were to be consulted, I’d say VIRTUALVINEYARD.COM is easily worth $50,000-$100,000. And with the right marketing moves, you can be sure that monthly search numbers would sky rocket.
    Trust me, I make bank.

  11. Max

    Enterpreneurs are terrified by don’t-be-evil. They are terrified that don’t-be-evil could penalizes them.
    Domainer must go further and give a FREE TRIAL PERIOD
    P.S. Please, almost all, stop writing bullshit ;)

  12. Max

    “please stop bullshits” ; ) was referred also to several other comments on the recent posts, not just the ones in this thread…

  13. Cara Mia

    Numbers never lie :) Personally I’d rather see them go with, it’s shorter, probably less than, has 1,500,000 monthly searches, and at least they wouldn’t be starting from scratch so to speak.
    Believe me I’ve been on the branding side of things and even if you have a cool catchy name it takes a great deal of effort, time and money to get it in front of people.

  14. Max

    Enterpreneurs are terrified by don’t-be-evil. They are terrified that don’t-be-evil could penalizes them.
    Domainers must go further and give a FREE TRIAL PERIOD

  15. Kobe Green >
    That is laughable to the point of absurdity.
    What does”wine vineyard” mean? It is almost a nonsensical combination. On the other hand,”virtual vineyard” makes a whole lot of sense. It’s almost the difference between grammatically correct English versus gibberish. Say the word combinations out loud and see for yourself.
    This preoccupation with the search results from Google or Bing or whatever else will be the ruin of people.
    Above all else, common sense trumps”numbers” when the domain doesn’t jive to the ears. People forget too quickly the”sauce” that differentiates successful domainers from the imposters.
    When picking domains either for branding or for yourself, you need to consider the concepts of LONG TAIL, EVERGREEN,and of course all the other pints (brandability, stickiness, memorable, euphony, etc.)
    To be a successful brander in the domain sphere, you need to have a background in English and grammar (English is and will forever be the dominant currency in domaining), psychology and common sense. Street smarts too I guess.
    I end another of Kobe Green’s famous rants with an example: Go look up”binders full of women”. See how many hits you get. Based on the search results, you’d think BINDERSFULLOFWOMEN.COM is the greatest domain since they invented the mousetrap.
    Now get back to me in a couple years. Mitt Romney will still be a has been and Obama will still be going”BAM!” and will be worthless.
    Peace. Remember, if you’re gonna play…play like a BOSS. I make bank.

  16. Max

    Need to organize a great international campaign, like dentists or other categories do every year
    For example, in January and February, or July and August.
    This could be the announcement:
    “Do you know that during February and March you can try the dentist, pardon, the domain that you prefer FOR FREE?
    Visit (or any other domain…) to know the list of d…omain available”

  17. UFO

    Monthly searches are just that, searches. But if you’re not on the first 3 pages of any results then you’re going to get virtually no traffic by this method.
    The only debate is whether XYZ is better or worse than ABC domain given the up front purchase price verses marketing spend etc etc. A small retailer can go for geographically reduced marketing coverage. The permutations and complexities are not fixed, if was rego price for 9.95 Pa then we’d go for that, but at 5m can I as a boutique wine producer even contemplate such a purchase, and even if I could would my market segment want such a generic brand, likely not. Its why companies like Firestone don’t rename themselves
    Anyway, I go with Kobe G, there’s logic and a more appropriate rationale for buying various domains, I.e. It depends!!

  18. Cara Mia

    & Kobe
    Right, so not as catchy for a brand name, I get it. All I’m saying is if 1.5 mil people are searching for”wine vineyard” there’s going to be some type-in traffic. Don’t you think it would be advantageous to at least snatch up that name and redirect it to the cool brand name with no searches or type-in traffic?

  19. David Wrixon

    In business, if you own horseshit, then you plug horseshit, unless you don’t actually need to plug anything anymore.
    At Chinese Domains, we have not really plugged anything for several years, and don’t intend to. Why would you want to convince others that you are sitting on one of the best investments in history?
    Sure a couple of years ago we had a serious cash situation. And sure back then we were plugging away, not that it really made a fat lot of difference.
    Having got past that, it is just a question of where we go next. The problem really is that nothing we ever will do will match what we have done, so future ventures are really going to be more a matter of personal indulgence than actually changing the World.

  20. Michael

    Cara mia you are reading the numbers wrong on Google keyword tools, 1.5 million is broad and the real number is only 320 globally for exact and local is 210. For a good keyword domain you want it to be a 1000 or more for local. 210 is not real bad because their is a lot of combinations of words that get nothing.
    Broad: The sum of the search volumes for the keyword, related grammatical forms, synonyms, and related words
    Exact: The search volume for that specific keyword and close variants
    Phrase: The sum of search volumes that include the whole phrase or near variants of the whole phrase

  21. Cara Mia

    You’re totally right, I’m reading the numbers wrong…my apologies. I’m still learning and I appreciate the correction. I also thank you for not being harsh, that shows integrity.


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